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	<title>Comments on: Call Me A Critical Masshole</title>
	<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/</link>
	<description>Efficiency is the straightest path to hell.*</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 15:50:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: wes</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7520</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 18:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7520</guid>
					<description>Haha Jen!  Excellent point!  I've been wanting a different set of rules for cyclists for a long time (stop sign = yield, stop light = stop sign, etc.), but never thought about the compounding effect upon the seeming idiocy of drivers.  I think I will still follow my own human set of rules: good judgment.  I think somewhere I've heard that jaywalkers are the least likely to get hit by a car...cause they are actually paying attention and using good judgment.

&quot;If you go hurtling through it as a bicyclist while all the cars stop because you think it’s safe enough and one of them hits you, or is distracted and hits someone else because you were careless, that wouldn’t be too great.&quot;  Really, I do agree with you.  Again, good judgment.  I wish when people discuss with me cyclists obeying traffic laws, they wouldn't bring up this very very minor percentage of the population that, like I've said before, deserve their own Darwin Award.  When I talk about rolling through a stop sign, that doesn't include when a pedestrian is crossing the street or cars approaching in the cross direction (nor stopping in front of me).  Same occurs with treating a stop light as a stop sign.  In fact, there are plenty of lights I just sit and wait for: too big to scurry across safely(I'm not a scurrier, pretty slow rider actually); overly complex; can't see oncoming traffic; etc.

Laws get in the way of people using good judgment.

Spencer, no dependents yet.  Maybe I will start wearing one then because that would change the odds/repercussions equation that happens subconsciously.  The odds just seem to stack up enough obviously.  I mean, we could all wear bullet proof vests and have gas masks on us at all times...just in case, but the odds just don't warrant such behavior, eh?

Critical Mass, to me, serves no purpose in terms of getting cyclists any rights.  I think it serves the purpose of getting a bunch of people together that choose a marginalized mode of transportation so that they can meet others, talk, and have some fun.  The whole idea of corking came from San Fran where the monthly rides are 5,000 deep and the streets are just filled with traffic.  I think there are only a couple hundred riders here in Seattle, which means that those leading the pack could choose to create a situation where corking is not needed, maybe just for the last dozen to get through the intersection.  Instead, the leaders might be running yellows, creating the situation where the entire pack has to run the red.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Haha Jen!  Excellent point!  I&#8217;ve been wanting a different set of rules for cyclists for a long time (stop sign = yield, stop light = stop sign, etc.), but never thought about the compounding effect upon the seeming idiocy of drivers.  I think I will still follow my own human set of rules: good judgment.  I think somewhere I&#8217;ve heard that jaywalkers are the least likely to get hit by a car&#8230;cause they are actually paying attention and using good judgment.</p>
<p>&#8220;If you go hurtling through it as a bicyclist while all the cars stop because you think it’s safe enough and one of them hits you, or is distracted and hits someone else because you were careless, that wouldn’t be too great.&#8221;  Really, I do agree with you.  Again, good judgment.  I wish when people discuss with me cyclists obeying traffic laws, they wouldn&#8217;t bring up this very very minor percentage of the population that, like I&#8217;ve said before, deserve their own Darwin Award.  When I talk about rolling through a stop sign, that doesn&#8217;t include when a pedestrian is crossing the street or cars approaching in the cross direction (nor stopping in front of me).  Same occurs with treating a stop light as a stop sign.  In fact, there are plenty of lights I just sit and wait for: too big to scurry across safely(I&#8217;m not a scurrier, pretty slow rider actually); overly complex; can&#8217;t see oncoming traffic; etc.</p>
<p>Laws get in the way of people using good judgment.</p>
<p>Spencer, no dependents yet.  Maybe I will start wearing one then because that would change the odds/repercussions equation that happens subconsciously.  The odds just seem to stack up enough obviously.  I mean, we could all wear bullet proof vests and have gas masks on us at all times&#8230;just in case, but the odds just don&#8217;t warrant such behavior, eh?</p>
<p>Critical Mass, to me, serves no purpose in terms of getting cyclists any rights.  I think it serves the purpose of getting a bunch of people together that choose a marginalized mode of transportation so that they can meet others, talk, and have some fun.  The whole idea of corking came from San Fran where the monthly rides are 5,000 deep and the streets are just filled with traffic.  I think there are only a couple hundred riders here in Seattle, which means that those leading the pack could choose to create a situation where corking is not needed, maybe just for the last dozen to get through the intersection.  Instead, the leaders might be running yellows, creating the situation where the entire pack has to run the red.
</p>
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		<title>by: Spencer</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7201</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 02:18:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7201</guid>
					<description>I'd like to ask the group what tangible good things has Critical Mass brought to Seattle?  i have no idea because I 1) have never participated and 2) am too lazy to search the internet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d like to ask the group what tangible good things has Critical Mass brought to Seattle?  i have no idea because I 1) have never participated and 2) am too lazy to search the internet.
</p>
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		<title>by: Spencer</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7199</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 02:16:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7199</guid>
					<description>wes,

I've gone through a few lights in my time so I'm not going to say your logic is wrong.  I only know I do it when I'm in a god-awful hurry because I left late.  SO I'm wrong on two points (and human).  
I just don't advocate doing it if you don't absolutely have to and if the intersection is absolutely clear.  By absolutely clear there are no (not a singe car) in the intersection.  When I ride I make absolutely no assumptions about any car with a person inside it.  I just say yesterday someone make a right turn from the left turn lane across two lanes of traffic just before the light turned.  Had I ventured out even two feet I would have been under or over this guys car.
As for the helmet.  I don't see any excuse.  but it's your life.  I hope you have no dependents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wes,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve gone through a few lights in my time so I&#8217;m not going to say your logic is wrong.  I only know I do it when I&#8217;m in a god-awful hurry because I left late.  SO I&#8217;m wrong on two points (and human).<br />
I just don&#8217;t advocate doing it if you don&#8217;t absolutely have to and if the intersection is absolutely clear.  By absolutely clear there are no (not a singe car) in the intersection.  When I ride I make absolutely no assumptions about any car with a person inside it.  I just say yesterday someone make a right turn from the left turn lane across two lanes of traffic just before the light turned.  Had I ventured out even two feet I would have been under or over this guys car.<br />
As for the helmet.  I don&#8217;t see any excuse.  but it&#8217;s your life.  I hope you have no dependents.
</p>
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		<title>by: JenMoon</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7180</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 01:22:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7180</guid>
					<description>Wes,

While I can understand your rationale, I don't necessarily think you are right.  Wearing a helmet like wearing a seat belt isn't only to cut down on healthcare costs not only to you but to the state but also to keep you safe.  I for one don't want to either watch someone slam their head into either the road (bicyclist) or a windshield (motorist...or bicyclist, for that matter).  You choosing to not be safe is only part of the equation although I understand it; wanting to ride your bike like when you were a kid with your hair flying behind you down a hill...well, I get that.  ;-)

As for laws being built so cars can go faster, I think that's perception.  A four way stop is for safety.  If you go hurtling through it as a bicyclist while all the cars stop because you think it's safe enough and one of them hits you, or is distracted and hits someone else because you were careless, that wouldn't be too great.  

If what you are proposing is one set of laws for cars using the streets and a second set for bikes, I'd vote against it even as a bicyclist.  Seattle motorists can barely remember the laws as they stand now (yes, you can make a u-turn provided it's safe; stop honking at me, you moron) so adding a second more complicated layer doesn't seem prudent.  Hell, they can't remember that you are supposed to stop at a crosswalk so how would they function if bicyclists didn't have to stop at 4 way stops?  (I personally don't care if they stop at a signal, look both ways and proceed if no one is coming but don't quote me on that one...)

It's not a matter of logistics or what would be easier for bikes; it's reality and consistency, sadly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wes,</p>
<p>While I can understand your rationale, I don&#8217;t necessarily think you are right.  Wearing a helmet like wearing a seat belt isn&#8217;t only to cut down on healthcare costs not only to you but to the state but also to keep you safe.  I for one don&#8217;t want to either watch someone slam their head into either the road (bicyclist) or a windshield (motorist&#8230;or bicyclist, for that matter).  You choosing to not be safe is only part of the equation although I understand it; wanting to ride your bike like when you were a kid with your hair flying behind you down a hill&#8230;well, I get that.  <img src='http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>As for laws being built so cars can go faster, I think that&#8217;s perception.  A four way stop is for safety.  If you go hurtling through it as a bicyclist while all the cars stop because you think it&#8217;s safe enough and one of them hits you, or is distracted and hits someone else because you were careless, that wouldn&#8217;t be too great.  </p>
<p>If what you are proposing is one set of laws for cars using the streets and a second set for bikes, I&#8217;d vote against it even as a bicyclist.  Seattle motorists can barely remember the laws as they stand now (yes, you can make a u-turn provided it&#8217;s safe; stop honking at me, you moron) so adding a second more complicated layer doesn&#8217;t seem prudent.  Hell, they can&#8217;t remember that you are supposed to stop at a crosswalk so how would they function if bicyclists didn&#8217;t have to stop at 4 way stops?  (I personally don&#8217;t care if they stop at a signal, look both ways and proceed if no one is coming but don&#8217;t quote me on that one&#8230;)</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not a matter of logistics or what would be easier for bikes; it&#8217;s reality and consistency, sadly.
</p>
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		<title>by: Matt the Engineer</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7067</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 20:09:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7067</guid>
					<description>Where are you Winnie?  That was the Washington state code (though yes, it's also legal in &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.seattle.gov/transportation/sdotfaqs.htm#bicycles&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Seattle&lt;/a&gt;). I suppose individual towns are probably able to outlaw sidewalk riding, and it sounds like a good idea to have it outlawed in your town.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where are you Winnie?  That was the Washington state code (though yes, it&#8217;s also legal in <a href="http://www.seattle.gov/transportation/sdotfaqs.htm#bicycles" rel="nofollow">Seattle</a>). I suppose individual towns are probably able to outlaw sidewalk riding, and it sounds like a good idea to have it outlawed in your town.
</p>
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		<title>by: Winnie</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7061</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 20:03:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7061</guid>
					<description>Sorry - interupted. The reason it is illegal is because out founding fathers either had no foresight or were too cheap and one person on a bike = the width of sidewalk. I hope Seattle is blessed with wide wide sidewalks to accomodate everyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry - interupted. The reason it is illegal is because out founding fathers either had no foresight or were too cheap and one person on a bike = the width of sidewalk. I hope Seattle is blessed with wide wide sidewalks to accomodate everyone.
</p>
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		<title>by: Winnie</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7057</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 19:55:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7057</guid>
					<description>To Matt the Engineer - don't live in Seattle; it's illegal here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Matt the Engineer - don&#8217;t live in Seattle; it&#8217;s illegal here.
</p>
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		<title>by: wes</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7049</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 19:39:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7049</guid>
					<description>Good call Spencer on the horse beating.  I could say its because there have been studies that show drivers give more space to cyclists without helmets...but that would be downright lying, and we all know it ;)
It might stem down to stubbornness.  Perhaps as I hear more and more arguments for and receive ever and ever more glares for not wearing a helmet, I continue to want to not wear a helmet.  Maybe a wish for the day when cycling is normal and safe enough that helmets and spandex aren't needed.  I don't know...but it is really my choice, and my lack of helmet does not make Dan or anyone else look bad or harder to get where he is going...so why the constant flack for it?  Just don't get it.  It seems people are focusing on solving a problem after the problem becomes one, rather than before.
As for the infrastructure and laws.  You have to agree that the infrastructure isn't setup well for a cyclist, no?  Moving on to the laws, its not a question of whether sitting at a light for a few extra seconds is a burden to me (I totally agree, if there is a point of safety to behaving in a certain way, like cars not speeding on local streets, then the few extra seconds is worth it).  It is that the laws have been made with the idea of increasing the rate at which cars can move along our streets, not keeping people safe.  The jaywalking law is there to keep objects out of the street so that the speed rating of the street can be increased.  Stop lights are controls to keep conflicting traffic (car, bike, and ped) out of the way.  Maybe that is a pretty negative view, but you have to agree that me stopping at a red light, looking both ways, then continuing once all cross traffic has ceased causes no harm.  In fact, I am able to get going on to the next light before I have all the cars behind me breathing down my neck.  They get to speed to the next light as they wish, and I can stay out of the way.
Does my rationale make any sense?  Note: I am not trying to encourage you to follow in my behavior, just trying to divert your attention away from minor infractions to rules and towards more productive places like actual improvements for cyclists and, yes, correcting the behavior of those very very few cyclists that dart in front of cars and run red lights without even slowing or looking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good call Spencer on the horse beating.  I could say its because there have been studies that show drivers give more space to cyclists without helmets&#8230;but that would be downright lying, and we all know it <img src='http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
It might stem down to stubbornness.  Perhaps as I hear more and more arguments for and receive ever and ever more glares for not wearing a helmet, I continue to want to not wear a helmet.  Maybe a wish for the day when cycling is normal and safe enough that helmets and spandex aren&#8217;t needed.  I don&#8217;t know&#8230;but it is really my choice, and my lack of helmet does not make Dan or anyone else look bad or harder to get where he is going&#8230;so why the constant flack for it?  Just don&#8217;t get it.  It seems people are focusing on solving a problem after the problem becomes one, rather than before.<br />
As for the infrastructure and laws.  You have to agree that the infrastructure isn&#8217;t setup well for a cyclist, no?  Moving on to the laws, its not a question of whether sitting at a light for a few extra seconds is a burden to me (I totally agree, if there is a point of safety to behaving in a certain way, like cars not speeding on local streets, then the few extra seconds is worth it).  It is that the laws have been made with the idea of increasing the rate at which cars can move along our streets, not keeping people safe.  The jaywalking law is there to keep objects out of the street so that the speed rating of the street can be increased.  Stop lights are controls to keep conflicting traffic (car, bike, and ped) out of the way.  Maybe that is a pretty negative view, but you have to agree that me stopping at a red light, looking both ways, then continuing once all cross traffic has ceased causes no harm.  In fact, I am able to get going on to the next light before I have all the cars behind me breathing down my neck.  They get to speed to the next light as they wish, and I can stay out of the way.<br />
Does my rationale make any sense?  Note: I am not trying to encourage you to follow in my behavior, just trying to divert your attention away from minor infractions to rules and towards more productive places like actual improvements for cyclists and, yes, correcting the behavior of those very very few cyclists that dart in front of cars and run red lights without even slowing or looking.
</p>
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		<title>by: Spencer</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7001</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:09:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-7001</guid>
					<description>Wes,
&quot;our infrastructure and laws are not setup to accommodate bicycle traffic&quot;

Even as a daily bicycle commuter, I'm not sure I agree with you.  How do you see our traffic regulations inhibiting bicycle movement?  Why is standing at a light for a few extra seconds a burden to you?  I can understand wanting to get away from car exhaust if that's your reason.

Also, I'm probably beating a dead horse here, but why no helmet?  What's the point?  Is it uncomfortable?   Is it not fashionable?  Do you get pimples from it?  It seems to me, and I'm sure someone has said this to you, it's such a small investment for arguably your most important organ.  Why take the added risk?  I understand it won't help you in a serious collision with a car but, in my experience, most accidents with bikes have to do with objects in the road and not cars.  In my 8 years of riding in Seattle I've never been hit by a car (with only a handful of close calls)but have been toppled over by objects either in the road or next to the road (potholes, fence covering, grates,etc.)  Even the smallest accident can have the the most serious results when you hit your head wrong on the ground.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wes,<br />
&#8220;our infrastructure and laws are not setup to accommodate bicycle traffic&#8221;</p>
<p>Even as a daily bicycle commuter, I&#8217;m not sure I agree with you.  How do you see our traffic regulations inhibiting bicycle movement?  Why is standing at a light for a few extra seconds a burden to you?  I can understand wanting to get away from car exhaust if that&#8217;s your reason.</p>
<p>Also, I&#8217;m probably beating a dead horse here, but why no helmet?  What&#8217;s the point?  Is it uncomfortable?   Is it not fashionable?  Do you get pimples from it?  It seems to me, and I&#8217;m sure someone has said this to you, it&#8217;s such a small investment for arguably your most important organ.  Why take the added risk?  I understand it won&#8217;t help you in a serious collision with a car but, in my experience, most accidents with bikes have to do with objects in the road and not cars.  In my 8 years of riding in Seattle I&#8217;ve never been hit by a car (with only a handful of close calls)but have been toppled over by objects either in the road or next to the road (potholes, fence covering, grates,etc.)  Even the smallest accident can have the the most serious results when you hit your head wrong on the ground.
</p>
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		<title>by: Dan Staley</title>
		<link>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-6995</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Aug 2008 16:57:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://noisetank.com/hugeasscity/2008/08/04/call-me-a-critical-masshole/#comment-6995</guid>
					<description>Aaaaa-men, Jen.

And I'd like to add one brief bit that IMHO distills it down for me: &lt;b&gt;the fraction that blows stop signs and does what they want make ME look bad and makes it harder for me to get where I'm going&lt;/b&gt;. I have to do extra work to look worthy to share the road. 

That's human nature. We can wishwishwish it didn't exist, or we can sack up, admit it does, and act appropriately. Then we would have fewer reasons to need Critical Mass.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aaaaa-men, Jen.</p>
<p>And I&#8217;d like to add one brief bit that IMHO distills it down for me: <b>the fraction that blows stop signs and does what they want make ME look bad and makes it harder for me to get where I&#8217;m going</b>. I have to do extra work to look worthy to share the road. </p>
<p>That&#8217;s human nature. We can wishwishwish it didn&#8217;t exist, or we can sack up, admit it does, and act appropriately. Then we would have fewer reasons to need Critical Mass.
</p>
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